Y'know, I kinda like this graphic from
he-who-may-only-be-known-as-Sabio. Check out both
the posting that goes with it, and
the one that follows. Just the thing for Easter Sunday!
And if you feel you'd like to share which among these options you currently find most convincing, well, step right up. I tend to the hot plate top right.
Hey,
ReplyDeleteThanx for the mention.
But I even like my new diagram better:
http://triangulations.wordpress.com/2012/04/07/how-do-you-view-the-bibles-jesus/
Sincerely,
"He who may be Known..."
Ehrman incites renewed debating like this entertaining Gladiatorial fight to the death where two apologists get more than they expected!
ReplyDeletehttp://www.amazon.com/review/R3R0MTA217BS5O/ref=cm_cd_pg_pg1?ie=UTF8&cdForum=Fx3SJNCFJLYQGZG&cdPage=1&asin=0062204602&store=books&cdThread=TxNDMKC2DI4PKW#wasThisHelpful
Jesus would have to be the ONLY historical person in the last 2,000 years to have so much invented about him and not be an invention himself. Reminds me of Zorro, who I know was just as real as Robin Hood.
ReplyDeleteJews probably weren't capable of making stuff up...well, except maybe for this one guy who led 3 million people around in the desert for 40 years and wrote all 5 books of the Pentateuch. Yeah, that guy may have had more said about him than Jesus and he certainly had more followers while he was alive than Jesus did. His miracles were more impressive too, especially that parting the Red Sea thing...
So, until someone comes up with evidence that could not be hearsay and/or forgery that depends on the bible for support, I'm gonna have to go with top left.
Neat chronological summary of skeptical scholars here:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.jesusneverexisted.com/scholars.html
Some paid with their lives like: "Giordano Bruno, Italian philosopher who taught in Paris and Wittenberg, paid the ultimate price for thinking for himself.
After languishing for 7 years in a dungeon of the Inquisition, where he was subjected to repeated torture, he was condemned and burned at the stake.
Bruno had had the audacity to suggest that space was boundless and that the sun and its planets were not unique"
Was surprised to catch Ehrman on Coast to Coast last night. At question time the phone lines were jammed showing a surprisingly high level of awareness of mythicism amongst the general population: this has to be bad news for Christendom (like The Church needs any more fires to put out).
ReplyDeleteVideo preview of show here:
http://www.coasttocoastam.com/videos/?uri=channels/455280/1639035
Thanx for the links "Mini". I think my new improved diagram (LINK HERE)
ReplyDeleteIllustrates the importance of look at two type of "Myths":
(a) Fabricated
(b) Fictionalized
I think the mythicists have shown us that much more was fabricated than we may think. As to how much was fabricated vs fictionalized is another question.
But no matter, fictionalized or fabricated, if a Jesus existed, he wasn't a Christian one.
In my opinion Paul's letters weren't written to enlighten people but were written to deceive people. Therefore, Bart's argument that Paul was honest yet mistaken isn't convincing. I don't believe anything a conman says and I think that "conman" describes Paul.
ReplyDeleteThe reason? Surviving being thrown to the lions. That didn't happen. Being taught his gospel by a raised from the dead Jesus. That didn't happen. Being taken up to the third heaven. That didn't happen. That the "Lord" taught him about the last supper (1 Cor. 11:23-25) and Jesus instituted it because Jesus knew that he was about to be betrayed. That didn't happen. That he was stoned to death but didn't die. That didn't happen. Too many things Paul said didn't happen. Jesus didn't happen either.
Corky, I like some the insights and chronology you have on early Pauline theology.
ReplyDeleteCheck here - http://vridar.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/reading-galatians-afresh-a-gnostic-paul-james-peter-and-john/#comments - for Paul's description of qualification for a gnostic apostle (pre Gospel and pre the anti-marcionite orthodoxy of Acts)